Amino acids.

[king]

Famous Dutch racer Ad Schaerlaeckens is quite blunt about it.
He describes the idea that youngsters taking a long time to fly a short toss being 'good for them' is utter nonsense. All that is happening is they are losing their confidence.
He is a wise old head and makes the observation that years ago you could jump them out to ten miles and then 20 miles and all would be good. For reasons we don't understand if you try that these days you stand a better than average chance of having a crash training toss and lose most of them.
I totally agree. If they beat me home from, say, 7 miles, great
I will take them back there next time just to reinforce the lesson. And so on out the road in easy stages.
I know blokes who have always gone way out for the first toss. They don't tell you much, but they aren't doing it now.....

I only flew sprint in the 80s and I agree with this straight from A to B if you are sprinting. But Ads view the birds are losing their confidence may not be true in many cases (hawks ect). Because I flew the distance my birds were allowed a less strict regime when trapping from training.(this never affected them when racing) I would often take them training and I thought the birds were taking a long time coming from training. They would sometimes take a hour or more from 20 miles. Then one day my wife said the birds had ALREADY returned and gone off again! When I found this out I then asked her to write down the time they arrived home IF she saw them, she wasn't that interested really.
The reason the birds probably did this is because my birds were used to flying up to 2hrs a day. And because of working shifts I didn't want them back in the loft having only flown say 15-20 mins when training. I used to start training my birds some 8 weeks before the first race and trained every 2 or 3 days. By doing this my birds still flew 1-2 hrs everyday. In the last 4 years before I stopped racing I could count on one hand the number of YBs I lost training. I started at 7 miles and they were at 20 miles the fourth toss. I've never been the best YB flyer in my area, I won and got cards in a few, but sent them for education and fed them to just get them home rather than win, but NOBODY around me raced YBs further than me, and they still haven't.

Now back to Ads view about late birds losing their confidence. I recall taking them training one day and was unsure if they had returned already and gone off again? They had been gone for near on 2 hours when a single bird returned and after it trapped I noticed it had a broken leg. All the others return some 20mins later. So far from losing confidence it was clear the birds didn't return because they happy still flying. The bird with the broken leg returned simply because it was injured and not lacking confidence.
This approach to training YBs wouldn't probably suit most, but it worked for me.

[Anthony webster]

I like to see birds doing a to b in good time but I'm never confident until they have a nightmare toss n return in singles, once they have had the nightmare toss I'm more confident in them, I don't think u teach pigeons loads just think it's down to us to have them in good health n great weight, I say this because in 2006 I had staff van reets I was training from ryegate Hill Surrey my birds took 21 mins never circled dead straight any weather 21 mins no faster a top old flyer called John Haynes said 16 to 18 mins to me and for 3 seasons I honestly thought he was pulling my plonker in 2009 I got the cyril lambrecht pigeons I trained same place but birds took a different route I thought they had gone the wrong way but they done ryegate hill in 16 mins most tosses first race they murdered my van reets n them same pigeons still run through my pig today, I just think good birds is so so important rest in to keep us happy.

[king]

I like to see birds doing a to b in good time but I'm never confident until they have a nightmare toss n return in singles, once they have had the nightmare toss I'm more confident in them, I don't think u teach pigeons loads just think it's down to us to have them in good health n great weight, I say this because in 2006 I had staff van reets I was training from ryegate Hill Surrey my birds took 21 mins never circled dead straight any weather 21 mins no faster a top old flyer called John Haynes said 16 to 18 mins to me and for 3 seasons I honestly thought he was pulling my plonker in 2009 I got the cyril lambrecht pigeons I trained same place but birds took a different route I thought they had gone the wrong way but they done ryegate hill in 16 mins most tosses first race they murdered my van reets n them same pigeons still run through my pig today, I just think good birds is so so important rest in to keep us happy.

Anthony you know Reed hill here on tne A10
I go 4/5 miles east of there this year so say 17/18 miles
2nd toss this year my hens went out flew SE the cocks went out drifted west to the A10
Just from that little difference 6 mins between them one followed the A10 the other across the fields straight home I was proper gutted
I have a pal who lives near A10 at hoddesdon he put a tracker on his the birds went down the A10 from Reed hill and turned left at the roundabout onto the Ware rd back to his .
Just two examples of why the A to B training is vital to me

Neil does the times of the birds from the same point differ in different winds? Whilst I expect it may not in training short distances, I believe it would when racing. I've lots of race results, and my old clubs winner from the same race point in different winds could be as much as 30 mins.

[king]

Talking of products Mike have you seen the new ones from China on ebay?

[Buster121]

They have them and loads other stuff on there, when you look at the ingredients all natural stuff or supposed to be, there stuff can treat salmonella in few days where vets stuff take up to ten days

[Anthony webster]

They have them and loads other stuff on there, when you look at the ingredients all natural stuff or supposed to be, there stuff can treat salmonella in few days where vets stuff take up to ten days

It's not natural there antibiotics that work against gram positive n negative bacteria OK pal.

[Anthony webster]

I'd like to read the ingredients on the back of the pack........

That's what I did main ingredient is sulfafurazole chloride if iv spelt it correctly..

[Buster121]

I'd like to read the ingredients on the back of the pack........

I asked for list and from what I could see was all plant ingredients

[Buster121]

This is what they sent me, by the way this was not those capsules but there one for salmonella

Mixed Feed Additive Eucommia Leaf Extract (Liquid) (Type II)

[Raw Material Composition] Eucommia Leaf Extract, Purified Water.

[Product Ingredient Analysis Guaranteed Value] (Active Ingredient Content per 1000ml of this Product)

[Anthony webster]

I'd like to read the ingredients on the back of the pack........

That's what I did main ingredient is sulfafurazole chloride if iv spelt it correctly..

Mmmm.
Not exactly 'natural'.
But the the word natural is badly abused these days. It is taken to mean 'good'. But so are diptheria and cholera and malaria and cancer and death natural......

Main ingredient 30mg a antibiotic that treats many things.