UkPigeonRacing

king wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 5:09 pm

Tony-P- wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 4:59 pm

king wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 4:55 pm

Yes I agree Danny. But that ain't going to happen is it. If it did happen it would change how the RPRA was run (administration), but it wouldn't change RACING in general. Clubs/Feds/Nationals would still retain the right to when and where they race from. They MUST race to a program that suits them.

Wouldn't members be able to vote on this at their clubs on whether it was to move the Lib points or the race dates

Yes Tony members at the AGM of clubs/Feds/Nationals propose both race programs and dates. I was pointing out we NEVER want the RPRA involved in this process.

O right, so if it's down to the members to vote why are they not voting for change of LIB location or Race Dates when to start the racing season if people are having so many bad losses maybe change it for a couple of years and see how things go

I’m with King on this one. It’s not the RPRA that has anything to do with race programs, start dates, end dates, race points or young bird losses.
Change can only happen by the members. The sport and race programs are dictated to a large degree by the nationals and classics and even more so by the internationals. The BICC program is solely dependent on the internationals to which the UK have no input as to their dates. So the other national clubs and classics and because of that the clubs, set their programmes to fit around the internationals.
Most transporters are not up to standard now a days or are too big for feds and cost too much to run. Instead of trying the impossible of getting feds to go together to fill the transporters maybe it would be better for the feds to downsize to a transporter more appropriate to the numbers sent. Instead the 3 counties we have a main lorry with the option of a trailer. If the birdage is going to be more than this we have a back up lorry as well. Numbers are sent to our secretary by a Thursday lunch time at which point the committee can decide what transport is required. The cost for us is 50p/pigeon. We also have 2 very good race controllers. Numbers of missing young birds across our 3 counties has been quite low this season. I am 2 youngsters missing from the last 4 races. I say missing because I think a lot of people say they have had heavy losses by the afternoon of a race. How many of those missing return at a later date?
I don’t deny that the BOPS are a problem but I think they are blamed for much more than they can possibly be responsible for.
I don’t think that rings should be issued before the 10th of January, but again as King says when to breed or use them is down to the fancier themselves.

king wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 6:59 pm

CHARLTON34 wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 5:59 pm They are the governing body King , how about they try something new & look into why so many pigeons are failing to get back to there lofts. This should be a priority surely investigation on there part, this year alone I'll say 4 weekends when the losses were horrendous, not a peep out of the CEO or anyone else for that matter.
They might sit up when ring sales for 2027 drop off & another drop in membership.

If the members don't know the reasons why birds are failing to return how will they know? Many are guessing the reasons why, maybe they can guess also? They can't wave a magic wand and make birds come back. Since the problem does not really effect old birds, it's NOT going to be easy to solve. A lack in homing ability seems top of the list. The answer maybe the WAY MANY RACE THEM. Many treat and try to race them like old birds and that's a mistake.

Racing YBs has over recent years got more difficult. Many send very large teams and expect to lose half. When I first began racing Education was the purpose of YB races. Today it's about Winning. Many think they can treat them and feed them like old birds.
When you send to you have to decide want your aim is. Racing or education. Winning or getting them back. The difference is how you prepare and feed them. You can't prepare a bird for a 1-2 hour fly and expect it still be flying many hours later. I myself when racing YBs wouldn't send a YB to even the first race if I didn't think it could still be flying 8 hours after liberation if it was needed to get home.
Many YBs are lost EVERY week simple because the run out of fuel before they can get home.

Yes King. I’m not that interested in young bird racing but do like to use it for education and selection for both my widowhood team and the ones I will breed from the following season. Mine are raced natural but I would expect them to complete the whole program. I only want, need, 4 young cocks to fill my widowhood team for next year so I don’t need to breed a big team of youngsters. My youngsters are bred as replacements and to race as old birds for the fourth coming seasons and not to just win young bird races which mean nothing.

king wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 6:59 pm

CHARLTON34 wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 5:59 pm They are the governing body King , how about they try something new & look into why so many pigeons are failing to get back to there lofts. This should be a priority surely investigation on there part, this year alone I'll say 4 weekends when the losses were horrendous, not a peep out of the CEO or anyone else for that matter.
They might sit up when ring sales for 2027 drop off & another drop in membership.

If the members don't know the reasons why birds are failing to return how will they know? Many are guessing the reasons why, maybe they can guess also? They can't wave a magic wand and make birds come back. Since the problem does not really effect old birds, it's NOT going to be easy to solve. A lack in homing ability seems top of the list. The answer maybe the WAY MANY RACE THEM. Many treat and try to race them like old birds and that's a mistake.

Racing YBs has over recent years got more difficult. Many send very large teams and expect to lose half. When I first began racing Education was the purpose of YB races. Today it's about Winning. Many think they can treat them and feed them like old birds.
When you send to you have to decide want your aim is. Racing or education. Winning or getting them back. The difference is how you prepare and feed them. You can't prepare a bird for a 1-2 hour fly and expect it still be flying many hours later. I myself when racing YBs wouldn't send a YB to even the first race if I didn't think it could still be flying 8 hours after liberation if it was needed to get home.
Many YBs are lost EVERY week simple because the run out of fuel before they can get home.

The voice of reason again King. They are all very valid points.
15 20 years ago feeding peas, beans n maize if you lost a young bird 9n race day it would usually be sat on the loft Sunday morning waiting to get in. Now you never see them again.
I do agree with much of what you say about the winning at all costs with young birds but that has become a big part of the sport and if you take that away I think you will lose even more fanciers.
Perhaps Dev is right, the losses are part of modern racing and maybe we should stop moaning and just get on with it. Those that want to do something to prevent it can to a degree and those that want to win have to accept it as part of the ruthless winning culture that they themselves have adopted.
Nonetheless you still have to accept that the abundance of percy is still a massive problem.

I would like to thank Diamond Dave. Over the years i have had birds coming home. This is when i was racing, they would come home with a slash across the chest. some with tail feathers missing. So some manuka honey, after i cleaned and glued the injury. The manuka honey spred over the injury, at this time i thought it was the birds hitting the wires on the way home. That bird would be left to recover, but looking out for stress problems was part of the recovery. So when the birds have been liberated, we really dont know what happens on their flight home. Until they arrive back home, some dont make the journey. But again we dont know why the failed to return, but i will say we have to look at ourselves as the keepers of the birds.
Preparation plays a very big part of racing pigeons, in breeding, racing, moulting and rest. If you want your birds to perform and show their true ability. Well they cant do it themselves, this is your part of the partnership. You have to be there for them 365 days a year, carrying out all loft tasks. In keeping the loft a clean environment, checking daily your birds are in good health. Good nutrition to get the best out of your birds, treating every bird as an individual. Because they are all different but equal. if you spend time with the birds. Observation will tell you what is going on in your loft, keeping to a routine will help not only yourself but most important the birds.
To me, preparation is the main tool for a good loft environment. Prepare or be prepared to fail.

@devo absolutely to do it well and have limited losses and good results it's a full time job I'm doing 13hr days 6 days a week

I get a lot of enjoyment out of reading old pictorials that I have been given.
Reading one from the 80s the Belgians had suffered a great deal of y.bird losses over a couple of seasons. Another from 1990 has a fella called David Belding talking about the extensive y.bird losses. So maybe its not only just what's happening now and it has always been a problem.....?

Diamond Dave wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2026 1:44 pm I get a lot of enjoyment out of reading old pictorials that I have been given.
Reading one from the 80s the Belgians had suffered a great deal of y.bird losses over a couple of seasons. Another from 1990 has a fella called David Belding talking about the extensive y.bird losses. So maybe its not only just what's happening now and it has always been a problem.....?

If you go back old articles, 50, 60, and 70s, there has always been a lot of Y/B losses, and before anybody says but this and that, Y/B losses are a fact of life. And like I have said before, we can't make them come back, we can only help them, and make sure they are fit to make the journey.

Diamond Dave wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2026 7:25 am

king wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 6:59 pm

CHARLTON34 wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2026 5:59 pm They are the governing body King , how about they try something new & look into why so many pigeons are failing to get back to there lofts. This should be a priority surely investigation on there part, this year alone I'll say 4 weekends when the losses were horrendous, not a peep out of the CEO or anyone else for that matter.
They might sit up when ring sales for 2027 drop off & another drop in membership.

If the members don't know the reasons why birds are failing to return how will they know? Many are guessing the reasons why, maybe they can guess also? They can't wave a magic wand and make birds come back. Since the problem does not really effect old birds, it's NOT going to be easy to solve. A lack in homing ability seems top of the list. The answer maybe the WAY MANY RACE THEM. Many treat and try to race them like old birds and that's a mistake.

Racing YBs has over recent years got more difficult. Many send very large teams and expect to lose half. When I first began racing Education was the purpose of YB races. Today it's about Winning. Many think they can treat them and feed them like old birds.
When you send to you have to decide want your aim is. Racing or education. Winning or getting them back. The difference is how you prepare and feed them. You can't prepare a bird for a 1-2 hour fly and expect it still be flying many hours later. I myself when racing YBs wouldn't send a YB to even the first race if I didn't think it could still be flying 8 hours after liberation if it was needed to get home.
Many YBs are lost EVERY week simple because the run out of fuel before they can get home.

The voice of reason again King. They are all very valid points.
15 20 years ago feeding peas, beans n maize if you lost a young bird 9n race day it would usually be sat on the loft Sunday morning waiting to get in. Now you never see them again.
I do agree with much of what you say about the winning at all costs with young birds but that has become a big part of the sport and if you take that away I think you will lose even more fanciers.
Perhaps Dev is right, the losses are part of modern racing and maybe we should stop moaning and just get on with it. Those that want to do something to prevent it can to a degree and those that want to win have to accept it as part of the ruthless winning culture that they themselves have adopted.
Nonetheless you still have to accept that the abundance of percy is still a massive problem.

I'll be the first to agree that Percy/BOP is a massive problem but. But they CANNOT be blamed for ALL the losses. Before BOP was a problem birds still got lost. One cause which never gets mentioned much is INJURY.
Many 100s will be killed on route home every week due to injury, but fanciers will probably blame BOP. Anybody who has seen a map of the National grid will notice quickly that there isn't many race points you can race from without crossing power lines. They are everywhere and increasing. As a kid me and by friends would walk under the lines every Sunday morning on a line running just North of York picking up rings from the dead birds of the Up North Combine. We collected a handful each most weeks. I've read Foxes have learnt to do the same for a easy meal.
Another hidden killer of pigeons is raised Motorway embankments. When pigeons fly very low in headwinds they only increase height to over come the obstacle, when they meet an road embankment they raise and fly over it at near road level flying straight into traffic, a whole group of birds 20 or more are killed at once. It does happen I've seen it.
Another cause which is not talked about is YBs turning Feral. A trip to any City center and you'll sport rung birds, the majority will be YBs. Another place Where your sure to find them is the East coast. With prevailing winds in the UK that's where they end up stopped by the sea. Tens of thousands of YBs can hide in plain sight around the country. And many forget the YB season is flown when FOOD is easy to find for lost birds. The Harvest.
Whilst fanciers losses are fresh in the minds just after the race, how many of the Birds DO actually return days, weeks, months later? True many don't but a good percentage DO. There can't be a fancier reading this who hasn't had a YB return missing from a race full of Barley?
You CAN'T change what happens after you send them to a race. They either return or they don't.
If your happy to start with a large team and try to fly the entire program maybe losing half, well carry on, because that trend ain't going to change. If you want birds to be educated and want some left, you can breed less. train or race lightly a couple of races and STOP them. You yourself choose the outcome.

Therein lies the key Albert. As King says y.bird racing should be about the education, not about the winning.
Maybe rather than stop racing for a year we could just stop y.bird racing. But like Danny there are a lot of y.bird specialists that contribute to the sport nowadays and I feel that more might be lost than gained.