Distance racing

[Andy]

Thanks Andy.
Got to ask is it you with a brother "Trev" who is the eyesign man.....

Yes Dave my brother is Trev. But it’s probably me that does more with the eyesign than Trev. Not so much nowadays as my sight isn’t as good nowadays. Only have one eye that works properly as I had a detached retina which tore in the other one. Had 6 operations on the eye to save it. I can see out of it but quite blurred.

[goose1]

Another question I would like to ask of you guys if you don't mind is...
Do you allow the birds that you have targeted for 500 + racing to breed and rear a round of y.birds or a single y.bird or not at all.

I don't think it really matters. Had success doing it all ways but personal preference would be to rear a youngster whether you let them lay again and split after say 10 days or leave the youngster with the cock etc would be up to the individual. I think rearing is the best way to slow the moult down naturally. I know a lot of top distance lads particularly in Holland are darkening the old birds to slow the wing moult. We'd never send a pigeon to the distance after its thrown its 3rd flight and would much prefer it to have only dropped the one by the main races. Each to their own of course.

[Diamond Dave]

Thanks Goose, I can't say I have paid too much attention to the moult (I don't think I wouldve sent any to any reasonable distance with a hole in the wing).
I am not one for early breeding so hopefully they have been OK.
Breeding for me has always been to suit me, not the distance I want to fly which has usually been about end of Feb beginning March.
Do you think if I paired a week or 2 later, it would be better for the wing condition?

The problem I would have with that is getting the y.birds away before those 2 early race which I need/like to get before the 1st channel race.

[goose1]

Thanks Goose, I can't say I have paid too much attention to the moult (I don't think I wouldve sent any to any reasonable distance with a hole in the wing).
I am not one for early breeding so hopefully they have been OK.
Breeding for me has always been to suit me, not the distance I want to fly which has usually been about end of Feb beginning March.
Do you think if I paired a week or 2 later, it would be better for the wing condition?

The problem I would have with that is getting the y.birds away before those 2 early race which I need/like to get before the 1st channel race.

It's not so much about the moult itself it's more about when you think a pigeon is in form in relation to the condition of the wing. And I know they'll be lads who say they've won when they've thrown x amount of flights or whatever. But using PIPA (which I don't like) as en example, go back and have a look at all the national winners from last year's International races they nearly always have a picture of the winners wings, and you'll seldom see one that's dropped more than 2 flights.

And pairing later isn't necessarily better for the wing although we do pair around mid Feb ourselves mainly because we don't like early breeding. When Wingdown(what a pigeon) was racing for example Alwyn used to pair him early December, let him rear to around 16/18 day then remove youngster and hen then repair a few weeks later to sit for a week or so before going onto full widowhood. There's many ways and as with everything no right and wrong way as such. The Padfields always let them rear then go back to nest and split when sitting around 10 days. That is the way we prefer to do it ourselves. However a couple of years back we flew chaos system and the hen that was 1st combine 497 miles 11hrs 27mins she didn't rear at the start of the season just sat a few days and then split she'd only thrown 1 flight by day of race mid July. She was a good hen though and was 5th Combine 190 miles 3 weeks earlier. Some years pigeons just thrown flights ealier than others and there's no real reason for it as such. And you can also get faster moulting families. I know Mark Bulled will tell you his pigeons are a fast moulting family and when the Pau national was moved to later in July he struggled to get the pigeons to hold the wing no matter what he tried.

I've probably rambled there apologies but listening to what your saying your probably best pairing first week in Feb to allow you to get the pigeons ready for the early races and giving you youngsters at the time of year you want. I'd make a note of when the pigeons do start to thrown their first flight and also what wing condition they were in when they went to the target races then you have some record for future years.

[Devo1956]

You need some really good birds, for these distances.

[Buster121]

Got a few well earnt trophies there

[Diamond Dave]

Thanks Goose, I can't say I have paid too much attention to the moult (I don't think I wouldve sent any to any reasonable distance with a hole in the wing).
I am not one for early breeding so hopefully they have been OK.
Breeding for me has always been to suit me, not the distance I want to fly which has usually been about end of Feb beginning March.
Do you think if I paired a week or 2 later, it would be better for the wing condition?

The problem I would have with that is getting the y.birds away before those 2 early race which I need/like to get before the 1st channel race.

It's not so much about the moult itself it's more about when you think a pigeon is in form in relation to the condition of the wing. And I know they'll be lads who say they've won when they've thrown x amount of flights or whatever. But using PIPA (which I don't like) as en example, go back and have a look at all the national winners from last year's International races they nearly always have a picture of the winners wings, and you'll seldom see one that's dropped more than 2 flights.

And pairing later isn't necessarily better for the wing although we do pair around mid Feb ourselves mainly because we don't like early breeding. When Wingdown(what a pigeon) was racing for example Alwyn used to pair him early December, let him rear to around 16/18 day then remove youngster and hen then repair a few weeks later to sit for a week or so before going onto full widowhood. There's many ways and as with everything no right and wrong way as such. The Padfields always let them rear then go back to nest and split when sitting around 10 days. That is the way we prefer to do it ourselves. However a couple of years back we flew chaos system and the hen that was 1st combine 497 miles 11hrs 27mins she didn't rear at the start of the season just sat a few days and then split she'd only thrown 1 flight by day of race mid July. She was a good hen though and was 5th Combine 190 miles 3 weeks earlier. Some years pigeons just thrown flights ealier than others and there's no real reason for it as such. And you can also get faster moulting families. I know Mark Bulled will tell you his pigeons are a fast moulting family and when the Pau national was moved to later in July he struggled to get the pigeons to hold the wing no matter what he tried.

I've probably rambled there apologies but listening to what your saying your probably best pairing first week in Feb to allow you to get the pigeons ready for the early races and giving you youngsters at the time of year you want. I'd make a note of when the pigeons do start to thrown their first flight and also what wing condition they were in when they went to the target races then you have some record for future years.

Certainly not rambling Goose and I appreciate you taking the time to text all that mate- I really can't tell you how helpful that info is.
I obviously knew about the moult but have never considered its importance other than not sending them when they are on the last 3 flights and honestly didn't realise how that level of observation could help when flying the distance.
Cheers mate.

[Andy]

Good info Goose.
It’s my understanding that in old birds the moult is usually triggered when the birds are sitting the second round of eggs shortly after 10 days sitting. This is why I pair my widowhood cocks up on Boxing Day and let them rear a round of youngsters, I keep very few stock birds. When the youngsters are around 14 days old, or as soon as the cock starts showing interest in the hen again, the hens are removed, before looking to go back down, with the cocks left to rear the youngsters until 21 days old. The youngsters are then weaned. The cocks and hens stay parted until about a month before the first race when they are repaired and allowed to sit for 10 days. The break stops them from starting to moult. Whilst sitting the eggs it is also when I try to give the cocks three or four short trainers as the hens will be in the loft on return. My cocks didn’t start dropping flights until after the sixth race, a couple later than that. My best cock was only growing his second flight by the end of the season having raced 14 races on consecutive weekends.
I know this is with my widowhood cocks more for sprint racing.
I have never tried it but I know some of the distance flyers snip the top of the next flight to drop which apparently makes them hold the previous flight longer.