Grit and Minerals

[Murray]

Since we are on the subject, I've been seriously thinking, no, I've decided I'm going to change from the grit I'm using.
They are so keen on it that I have to ration it or they pump the babies full of it and that is not good. It must have something in it that they really like.
I'm going to get some other grit and a bucket of PVM mineral powder and see how that goes.

[goose1]

I know what we are told about the need for Grit and Minerals but what I’m asking is what is other members experiences of them rather than their thoughts on using them.
I haven’t really used any grit or minerals for years. Mine seem to do fine without it.
Last week I had a new wholesaler delivery for our pet shop. Most of our wholesalers now do very little in the way of pigeon products and being a tight git I only use what I can buy at wholesale price rather than retail price.
This new wholesaler does do a few more products for pigeons. So after looking through what they had I brought pickstones, grit and minerals. I put a pot of each in each of my 3 sections. My pigeons have hardly touched any of them.
How much do other members find their birds take and do you think it actually makes any difference?

To be honest we use lots. Matrix, De pattagoon, red stone grit mixed together every day in life (except if treating) black minerals twice a week (only on dry days and only left in for a couple of hours) they would get this more often when feeding young. Salt licks are in the stock and young bird avairy all year round. Old birds would have one when rearing. Egg food again when rearing and homoform is used all year round. We'd rather use the above than putting stuff on the feed and water to be honest then they can take what they want/need but that's just what we do

[goose1]

I know of a very good sprint flyer who has won over 50 first feds who never gives any grit as he says it’s unneeded ballast.

That is a good point I wouldn't use it Thursday or Friday if I were to sprint again

[goose1]

This is information from a top guy in the sport, some will agree and once again some wont. But the choice is your birds, your choice. Just to inform members, I put these videos up to help new starters in the sport.

Who has told you he's a top guy in the sport? Himself?

I'm not having a pop at you but you can pick so many holes in what that guy says on so many of his videos.

As opposed to watching videos on YouTube a new starter would be far better off getting to know one of the top lads in their area and spending as much time as possible watching listening and learning

[goose1]

Great vid Dev which makes great sense to me.
This doesn't explain Andys experience of not feeding grit but I wonder if Andys birds might be on open hole or something, maybe allowed to pick up off the garden
where they satisfy their own intake of hard stones.
My own feeling echoes What this guy says im the video in that the amount of actual "ginding" grit required is negligable but best kept fresh.
The de patagoons brand and others similar are simply full of other stuff that the birds just like to eat like sweets to a child.
Enjoyed that 2nd vid Dev. Thanks for posting it mate.

I am mainly talking about my widowhood cocks when regards to racing Dave. They were exercised twice a day and never went down in the garden. They had every race of the old bird season, 14 races, and never had any grit during all that time. They preformed well enough.

When you say performed well enough what do you mean Andy? And please don't think I'm having a pop mate because I'm absolutely not I'm just wondering what level of performance your happy with and would you consider changing if you thought you could improve results

[Andy]

Great vid Dev which makes great sense to me.
This doesn't explain Andys experience of not feeding grit but I wonder if Andys birds might be on open hole or something, maybe allowed to pick up off the garden
where they satisfy their own intake of hard stones.
My own feeling echoes What this guy says im the video in that the amount of actual "ginding" grit required is negligable but best kept fresh.
The de patagoons brand and others similar are simply full of other stuff that the birds just like to eat like sweets to a child.
Enjoyed that 2nd vid Dev. Thanks for posting it mate.

I am mainly talking about my widowhood cocks when regards to racing Dave. They were exercised twice a day and never went down in the garden. They had every race of the old bird season, 14 races, and never had any grit during all that time. They preformed well enough.

When you say performed well enough what do you mean Andy? And please don't think I'm having a pop mate because I'm absolutely not I'm just wondering what level of performance your happy with and would you consider changing if you thought you could improve results

No offence taken at all Goose. I am honest in my performances and experiences. Yes I could probably do a bit better and don’t make excuses. I am one of the shortest fliers in both our club and also the 3 counties. Our club covers a radius of 30 miles East to West and around 10 miles South to North. The 3 counties covers most of Somerset, and all of Devon and Cornwall, I’m at Wincanton. John Angwin in Penzance flys nearly 150 miles further than me and I am around 35 miles North of the South Coast. With the old birds I only really raced a team of 7 widowhood cocks. 6 of these had all 14 old bird races. My best cock was my first bird from 11 of the 14 races. The first 4 races to me were from Stoney Cross just 34 miles. Racing against upwards of 2,500 pigeons in the open, 1290 in the section and 450 in our club alone. It is a very strong club. The results in these included a 3rd club, 8th section, 20th open and a 9th club, 9th section, 15th open. Then we had Chale 57 miles and two from Littlehampton 83 miles. From one of the Littlehampton races I was 1st club, 1st section, 11th open with the first 10 in the open all well down in Devon in a NW wind. Then we had another Stoney Cross but this time I sent with the West of England South Road Combine and had 5 of my 6 in 2 minutes with the other 5 minutes later. Being 37th, 39th & 44th combine. Apart from one more Stoney Cross the last five races were 2 x Eastbourne 118 miles, 1 x Maidstone 128 miles and 2 x Ramsgate 168 miles. First Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 3 minutes. Second Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 2 minutes, Maidstone first bird was 5th club, 5th section, 19th open 18 minutes in front of my next bird then I had 4 of the other 5 in 2 minutes. From the 2 Ramsgate’s I had all 6 from both fairly close together when some members were several missing.
So no not fantastic. But considering my loft location and the fact that I work 6 days a week and only have around an hour a day with the birds if I’m lucky and apart from 3 tosses from 8 miles before the season started and nothing since not to bad. Hopefully retiring soon and moving so will get more time.

[goose1]

I am mainly talking about my widowhood cocks when regards to racing Dave. They were exercised twice a day and never went down in the garden. They had every race of the old bird season, 14 races, and never had any grit during all that time. They preformed well enough.

When you say performed well enough what do you mean Andy? And please don't think I'm having a pop mate because I'm absolutely not I'm just wondering what level of performance your happy with and would you consider changing if you thought you could improve results

No offence taken at all Goose. I am honest in my performances and experiences. Yes I could probably do a bit better and don’t make excuses. I am one of the shortest fliers in both our club and also the 3 counties. Our club covers a radius of 30 miles East to West and around 10 miles South to North. The 3 counties covers most of Somerset, and all of Devon and Cornwall, I’m at Wincanton. John Angwin in Penzance flys nearly 150 miles further than me and I am around 35 miles North of the South Coast. With the old birds I only really raced a team of 7 widowhood cocks. 6 of these had all 14 old bird races. My best cock was my first bird from 11 of the 14 races. The first 4 races to me were from Stoney Cross just 34 miles. Racing against upwards of 2,500 pigeons in the open, 1290 in the section and 450 in our club alone. It is a very strong club. The results in these included a 3rd club, 8th section, 20th open and a 9th club, 9th section, 15th open. Then we had Chale 57 miles and two from Littlehampton 83 miles. From one of the Littlehampton races I was 1st club, 1st section, 11th open with the first 10 in the open all well down in Devon in a NW wind. Then we had another Stoney Cross but this time I sent with the West of England South Road Combine and had 5 of my 6 in 2 minutes with the other 5 minutes later. Being 37th, 39th & 44th combine. Apart from one more Stoney Cross the last five races were 2 x Eastbourne 118 miles, 1 x Maidstone 128 miles and 2 x Ramsgate 168 miles. First Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 3 minutes. Second Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 2 minutes, Maidstone first bird was 5th club, 5th section, 19th open 18 minutes in front of my next bird then I had 4 of the other 5 in 2 minutes. From the 2 Ramsgate’s I had all 6 from both fairly close together when some members were several missing.
So no not fantastic. But considering my loft location and the fact that I work 6 days a week and only have around an hour a day with the birds if I’m lucky and apart from 3 tosses from 8 miles before the season started and nothing since not to bad. Hopefully retiring soon and moving so will get more time.

Nothing wrong with them results mate. In fact with such limited time and a very small team I'd say they've more than held their own. Reading them distances you must fly fairly close to them Staddon lads? Or am I way off there?

[Andy]

When you say performed well enough what do you mean Andy? And please don't think I'm having a pop mate because I'm absolutely not I'm just wondering what level of performance your happy with and would you consider changing if you thought you could improve results

No offence taken at all Goose. I am honest in my performances and experiences. Yes I could probably do a bit better and don’t make excuses. I am one of the shortest fliers in both our club and also the 3 counties. Our club covers a radius of 30 miles East to West and around 10 miles South to North. The 3 counties covers most of Somerset, and all of Devon and Cornwall, I’m at Wincanton. John Angwin in Penzance flys nearly 150 miles further than me and I am around 35 miles North of the South Coast. With the old birds I only really raced a team of 7 widowhood cocks. 6 of these had all 14 old bird races. My best cock was my first bird from 11 of the 14 races. The first 4 races to me were from Stoney Cross just 34 miles. Racing against upwards of 2,500 pigeons in the open, 1290 in the section and 450 in our club alone. It is a very strong club. The results in these included a 3rd club, 8th section, 20th open and a 9th club, 9th section, 15th open. Then we had Chale 57 miles and two from Littlehampton 83 miles. From one of the Littlehampton races I was 1st club, 1st section, 11th open with the first 10 in the open all well down in Devon in a NW wind. Then we had another Stoney Cross but this time I sent with the West of England South Road Combine and had 5 of my 6 in 2 minutes with the other 5 minutes later. Being 37th, 39th & 44th combine. Apart from one more Stoney Cross the last five races were 2 x Eastbourne 118 miles, 1 x Maidstone 128 miles and 2 x Ramsgate 168 miles. First Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 3 minutes. Second Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 2 minutes, Maidstone first bird was 5th club, 5th section, 19th open 18 minutes in front of my next bird then I had 4 of the other 5 in 2 minutes. From the 2 Ramsgate’s I had all 6 from both fairly close together when some members were several missing.
So no not fantastic. But considering my loft location and the fact that I work 6 days a week and only have around an hour a day with the birds if I’m lucky and apart from 3 tosses from 8 miles before the season started and nothing since not to bad. Hopefully retiring soon and moving so will get more time.

Nothing wrong with them results mate. In fact with such limited time and a very small team I'd say they've more than held their own. Reading them distances you must fly fairly close to them Staddon lads? Or am I way off there?

In the same club as John & Dave Staddon Goose. Glastonbury FC. Dave is the 3 counties race controller. His done a great job this year. We have 18 members in our club with at least 14 sending every week with up to 500 birds. Other members include Gary & Prilly Hodges and John Halstead, both national winners this year. It’s a great club to be part of. We also fly in the West of England South Road Combine but not many send with that now.

[goose1]

No offence taken at all Goose. I am honest in my performances and experiences. Yes I could probably do a bit better and don’t make excuses. I am one of the shortest fliers in both our club and also the 3 counties. Our club covers a radius of 30 miles East to West and around 10 miles South to North. The 3 counties covers most of Somerset, and all of Devon and Cornwall, I’m at Wincanton. John Angwin in Penzance flys nearly 150 miles further than me and I am around 35 miles North of the South Coast. With the old birds I only really raced a team of 7 widowhood cocks. 6 of these had all 14 old bird races. My best cock was my first bird from 11 of the 14 races. The first 4 races to me were from Stoney Cross just 34 miles. Racing against upwards of 2,500 pigeons in the open, 1290 in the section and 450 in our club alone. It is a very strong club. The results in these included a 3rd club, 8th section, 20th open and a 9th club, 9th section, 15th open. Then we had Chale 57 miles and two from Littlehampton 83 miles. From one of the Littlehampton races I was 1st club, 1st section, 11th open with the first 10 in the open all well down in Devon in a NW wind. Then we had another Stoney Cross but this time I sent with the West of England South Road Combine and had 5 of my 6 in 2 minutes with the other 5 minutes later. Being 37th, 39th & 44th combine. Apart from one more Stoney Cross the last five races were 2 x Eastbourne 118 miles, 1 x Maidstone 128 miles and 2 x Ramsgate 168 miles. First Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 3 minutes. Second Eastbourne 3 from 6 in 2 minutes, Maidstone first bird was 5th club, 5th section, 19th open 18 minutes in front of my next bird then I had 4 of the other 5 in 2 minutes. From the 2 Ramsgate’s I had all 6 from both fairly close together when some members were several missing.
So no not fantastic. But considering my loft location and the fact that I work 6 days a week and only have around an hour a day with the birds if I’m lucky and apart from 3 tosses from 8 miles before the season started and nothing since not to bad. Hopefully retiring soon and moving so will get more time.

Nothing wrong with them results mate. In fact with such limited time and a very small team I'd say they've more than held their own. Reading them distances you must fly fairly close to them Staddon lads? Or am I way off there?

In the same club as John & Dave Staddon Goose. Glastonbury FC. Dave is the 3 counties race controller. His done a great job this year. We have 18 members in our club with at least 14 sending every week with up to 500 birds. Other members include Gary & Prilly Hodges and John Halstead, both national winners this year. It’s a great club to be part of. We also fly in the West of England South Road Combine but not many send with that now.

Ahh I thought your distances looked similar to some of the distances I'd seen them lads flying. Good competition in that club for sure. What kind of a season did the Staddons have? They didn't seem as prevalent on the national results this year

[Andy]

Dave and John didn’t have their usual season. Of course the heat of the summer resulting in some terrible national and international races with heavy losses didn’t help. In one race they sent 29 yearlings, I think it was the CSCFC Pau race. Their first bird wasn’t until day 3 and he died the following day. I’m not sure how many he got back in the end but I know they lost a lot. From Perpignan they were 4th section 21st open with their only entry. They did get a few reasonable section results including winning the old hens races, but for them a mediocre season. They have done well with their youngsters in the 3Cs, sending up to 100 birds per week, but didn’t send to any of the classics or nationals. They did build a large new loft for their youngsters this year.