Total Widowhood

[Tony-P-]

I think this another area where we can start fooling ourselves that our results are down to what we choose to do, rather than the pigeons.
For instance, there was a bloke in NZ years ago who had 12 cocks in a widowhood section that raced the whole program, and won a lot. At 4 years of age they had never been paired up. They'd never seen a hen.
And here's us stressing over whether to show the hen, or for how long.
I used to show them the hens sometimes, just the nest bowl sometimes, put some straw in the nest box sometimes, nothing at all sometimes, just to keep them guessing.
Good pigeons. That's the secret.

Good to hear Murray, so are you saying it's down to the Pigeon it's self and not really the tricks for motivation

[Murray]

Hi Tony.
Yes.
It always is the pigeon. On a level playing field the better pigeon will always win.
For most of us all we can do is make sure that no stupid mistakes have been made and the pigeon goes away with an equal chance of succeeding.
There are people who are second or even third generations of the highest class fanciers. Like Hans and Evert Jan Eijerkamp. They have been raised knowing the 1% secrets that most of us never know.
But my advice is, never start thinking that success or failure is dependent on what you do to them.
They are the athletes. You are just the support crew.
Best of luck.
Murray

[chrisroscoe]

I raced roundabout tbh as I liked to race all my birds , so not much help haha

[Andy]

I race total widowhood Leon.
I have predominantly been racing just 6 cocks all season. They have had 13 races, every week since the start of the season, this weekend will be their 14th and final race this year.
My cocks are all individually fed in their boxes. Morning and night.
The hens are in a section with box perches. The odd ones do pair together and they do lay eggs but doesn’t seem to knock their enthusiasm for the cocks at weekends, so doesn’t bother me. I do have spare hens just incase I need to change a couple. The hens never go out during the old bird season.
I don’t have much time on marking night. I shut the shop at 17.00 and have to be up the club for 18.00, it’s a 40 minute drive for me to get there.
When I shut the shop I take the basket up to the loft. I put the basket in the hens section with the top open. I then go and put the nest bowls in with the cocks. They are straight in the bowls cooing and I shut the fronts up with them inside. I then go back into the hens section where some of the hens have already jumped into the basket and the others are either on it or beside it. I just pick them up and put them in.
I then take them into the cocks. I take them out one by one and put them in with their cocks. Within just a minute or so the cocks will be cooing low in the bowl with the hen standing over them. I never let them mate. Once the cock is cooing low in the bowl I gently pick them up and put them in the basket. With just the 6 cocks it takes me all of around 5 minutes to basket them. The hens are then left shut in the boxes.
Once I know the birds are up the next morning the hens will have been fed and will be shut in half the box awaiting the arrival of the cocks. When the cocks arrive back they are allowed to stay in with their hens for a couple of hours before the hens are removed back into their section.

Do you only Fly Cock's Andy ?
Do you not fly the Hen's that are in the box with the cock's
And is there a reason you don't race the Hen's mate

Yes Tony I only race the cocks.
The hens don’t even fly out while being used for the widowhood system. They do fly out early in the year and will be flown out again after this weekends race which is the last old bird race. They will be left with the cocks and left to rear a few latebreds. They also rear a round early in the year.
For me the hens have their own job to do. That is to motivate the cocks. I also look on the hens as stock hens. I keep hardly any stock birds so my race team is mainly bred from the widowers. So I want my cocks to be doing the racing, and hopefully winning, and my hens to be breeding the racing cocks.
I know a lot of people now race the roundabout system so that they can race their hens. But although the hens can do well I don’t think you get the best out of the cocks. Why race the hens if the cocks are winning.
Having said that this is the first year where I will be able to race old birds as trainers with the youngsters. So once they are settled back into the widowhood loft and exercising well I may give some of the hens a few chucks.
With the youngsters birds the young hens will race their program. The young cocks will get a few races but I will also look to stop racing any that show potential to be part of my widowhood team next year. I only breed around 20 youngsters.

[Tony-P-]

Andy, everyone has there way of racing their Pigeons, but I have always been told to breed best to best.

If you don't race your Hen's how do you know which Hen is best for the best cock in your loft ?

[Spieker-Loft]

Question for those here who are racing Total widowhood or have done.

What are you methods of motivation with this system.

Myself i let the hens and cocks together in the boxes on basketing day for about 15-20 minutes. Then i put them in the basket and let them sit in there for 30-45 minutes before we start driving for basketing.

If it was up to my father he would prefer to lock the hens into the boxes close them and have the cock infront of the box.

My good friend jan who is a top racer in our fed. doesnt let them together at all before the race and only lets the cocks into the box themself then baskets the cocks and lets the hens into the box after. And only on race day lets them together on arrival.

Now As well as letting them together fully on basketing day has worked for me this year. I do also doubt it a bit still because i hear more people telling me that they dont show the partner at all before the races due to it apparently draining them and making them nervous.
Wonder if anyone here has raced Total widowhood and what methods they have done

Great thread Leon.
Can I ask - when you basket the cocks and leave them for 30 -45 minutes, - is that still in the loft so they are still looking at their hens?

This is in the transport basket in which i bring to them the actual basketing. I leave them in a chilled area somewhere for 30-45 minutes. Id like to think that it calms them down a bit because i do believe that grabbing the pigeons and seperating them etc is a bit stressfull for them
Obviously my hens and cocks are seperated in the transport basket so no its just themself in their transport basket for 30-45 min before putting them in the car to drive to the actual basketing. I try to find the coldest spot somewhere on my property outside usually in the shadow

[Spieker-Loft]

Very interesting methods before racing, it'll be good to hear other peoples tricks of the trade.

Motivation is key my friend. There are plenty of methods of motivation tho. For example about 3 days before basketing i start feeding them peeled sunflower seeds as an additional fat source. They see them as treats and love them. I feed these in a little bowl in their box. usually all their feeding happens in a Trough. but this treat i give them specially in their boxes 1 hour after feeding because i think it increases their bond to the box etc.

As i said there is plenty of tips and tricks for motivation and almost everyone does it their own way. And as i always say whatever works best for you and not everthing that works for me will work for everyone else !

thanks Leon, and yes there's that many different methods, but it's good to hear some new ones like your feed in the box mate

heres a picture of my yearlings getting their 2nd last feed before basketing tomorrow. Tomorrow they will be on just a very light feed on basketing day

[Devo1956]

Great information being shared, well done Leon.

[Diamond Dave]

Yes. Thanks Leon. Those boxes are interesting -are they hen boxes....

[Spieker-Loft]

Yes. Thanks Leon. Those boxes are interesting -are they hen boxes....

Yes hen boxes with doors on the front