Winfort Lofts wrote: Thu Oct 15, 2026 10:13 am
With out meaning to cause any undue alarm...
I have reason to change my mind about the risks of Ai and ETS systems.
Exactly Matt, that's why I started the topic off it's been going on with improbable velocity & altering the results sheets.
AI has nothing to do with it. YOU CAN'T print or alter a result with AI. Any improbable velocity MUST involve 'cheating' the ETS system. ( and by this I mean by cheating a perfectly working system WITHOUT touching it) AI can't do this, but 2 people at marking can.
Technically correct, the easiest way, that's the most difficult to stop is two bent members on marking/Striking duties!
Winfort Lofts wrote: Thu Oct 15, 2026 10:13 am
With out meaning to cause any undue alarm...
I have reason to change my mind about the risks of Ai and ETS systems.
Hello Matt, can I ask your thoughts on why you have doubts please.
You can and I'll be more than happy to share my thoughts, concerns later on tonight or possibly tomorrow. I need to confirm something via testing first.
It's stopping fancier's getting the credit they deserve with hard work & getting the best out of there pigeons.
Yes Matt if protocols aren't followed then this is a possibility.
So, things took a bit longer than I would have liked, and I'm now left with more concerns than previously thought.
As much as I previously said I would explain all, I now feel that I should perhaps, in the interest of the sport hold off sharing details, I am however now in contact with a few ets manufacturers, sharing with them directly the concerns.
Hi
i have been told that there is ways to cheat with ETS but each example i am given needs to break clocking rules one way or another. i know one federation went before the RPRA for getting the result from the cloud for a benzing clock which was thrown out. Which was a gold ring race and the fancier lost a lot of money. So if you was to use Ai to change results how would you do it at the club with members present
cheers Jack
Evening Matt, after the obvious concern regarding your post, I am so pleased that we have you to support the fancy regarding these matters.
However, I am just left wondering and perhaps hoping, if it would be a better option to share your discoveries with the fancy so that we can all be aware of the potential dangers and what to look out for.
Cheating has been going on this season & previous years, your all entitled to your own opinions, some say it can't be done but I'm telling you all it is. Pigeons racing isn't any different to any other thing when money is involved cheating will happen however foolproof, any rules or electronic timing system used & should be called out jmo.
I know it happens and it is disgusting that people feel the need to do it, and yes it is because of the money involved really either in the race or from later sales of birds. I may be naive as I would never dream of doing it so not sure how it is possible but is it any easier to cheat using AI and or ETS than the old days with rubbers and manual clocks?
Andy wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2026 9:29 pm
I know it happens and it is disgusting that people feel the need to do it, and yes it is because of the money involved really either in the race or from later sales of birds. I may be naive as I would never dream of doing it so not sure how it is possible but is it any easier to cheat using AI and or ETS than the old days with rubbers and manual clocks?
This is the very reason that I feel that Matt should "out" his discoveries to the fancy first and foremost.
He has obviously found something that shows the systems to be "fallable" and susceptible to Ai interference. If that is the case Andy then I would say yes, it would be easier to cheat if someone has that sort of knowledge because they are likely to be able to interfere with their own system.
Andy wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2026 9:29 pm
I know it happens and it is disgusting that people feel the need to do it, and yes it is because of the money involved really either in the race or from later sales of birds. I may be naive as I would never dream of doing it so not sure how it is possible but is it any easier to cheat using AI and or ETS than the old days with rubbers and manual clocks?
This is the very reason that I feel that Matt should "out" his discoveries to the fancy first and foremost.
He has obviously found something that shows the systems to be "fallable" and susceptible to Ai interference. If that is the case Andy then I would say yes, it would be easier to cheat if someone has that sort of knowledge because they are likely to be able to interfere with their own system.
I don't think the ETS systems can be hacked by software or AI. I myself think ETS systems are secure, it's the honesty of those actually putting the birds through that is the question. I know for certain I could basket a bird at any club marking and not be caught. The ETS system would NOT be cheated at all. It would work as it should. And AI plays no part. The hardest part would be just getting the arrival time right as not to arouse suspicion.
If I told you hard easy it is to do, you would not trust anybody at marking.
